Hate Mail "There is still debate over whether fluoride has ANY benificial effects."
The Agnostic Phil Stalheim file

His letters are in yellow, whilst mine are in black & white.

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Subject: Phil, the "Agnostic" hatemailer...

I've read Phil's emails, and WOW.

Phil sounds like he just escaped from a mental institution. He has symptoms of paranoid schizophrenia. He should seek psychiatric help.

Also, Phil stated that engineers tend to be illogical and "complete morons," because they deal with machines.... I fail to see the logic in his argument. My father is an engineer, and he's one of the most logical, sane people you'll ever meet. Awesome person, my father.

Phil, the "conspiracy theorist," as I will call him, needs to re- evaluate his life, because to me, he sounds like a, well, for lack of a better word, fucking nutcase.

So Phil, here's some advice. Learn how to spell and formulate coherent sentences, and get off your "conspiracy theory" wagon, because, quite frankly, it's ILLOGICAL.

Thank you.

Ian

*****


I have absolutely no idea where to start. I checked on his flouride thing, and looked into the CV of the toxicologist who says that flouride damages rat brains. It's legit research, but I'm hesitant to babble incessantly about quality of research and number of reproducable events. My undergrad major was in microbiology (here at the U of I it's pretty much bacteriology) and I have had toxicology courses as well. One of the central messages of toxicology is that everything is lethal at some dose. Public health has to weigh certain aspects of toxicology versus bacterial infection. That is why city water undergoes chlorination or bromination. Chlorine, bromine and flourine are all halogens which are reactive. The fact is there is an optimum level at which chlorine is added to the water that the bacteria can not replicate. This is balanced against the level of toxicity of the individual halogen. Just for your info, brominated compounds are much more toxic than the chlorinated ones. I'd imagine there is probably a correlation between optimum flourine concentration and a reduction in heart disease/bacterial infection. When one brushes teeth, transient levels of bacteria in the blood are found. This is most likely because of micro-cuts in the oral cavity caused by abrasion.

Living in the cornfields of illinois has *some* random benefits. I can easily afford to eat organic produce, locally grown, and I do. I have researched many herbicides including atrazine, which is a possible endocrine disrupter. Once you read the MSDS on most of these compounds, you really wonder who runs the FDA. The problem isn't an individual say apple with residue of herbicide/pesticide on it. It's that the residue (and sometimes un-modified compound) becomes distributed all over the environment and are present at unusually high concentrations in the drinking water and surface water. It becomes anti-environmentalist to eat non-organic food, since some of these compounds have deleterious effects on animal and plant life.

One interesting note, is that they (I'd have to look up the research group again, and I should really get to work) have found high levels of anti-depressants and anti-psychotics in city water. Qualities of a useful psychological medication are that you don't have to take many per day to get the desired effect. This means that the compound can not be degraded into other compounds in the body. Now molecule "N" stays in the body for 12 hours. Over this time, the body doesn't degrade the compound, but it leaks out of the body through urine. If the compound is designed not to be reactive in the body, it is most likely not going to be degraded (at least much) by say, sitting in water. Once the urine is flushed to the water reclamation district the molecule "N" doesn't react with the treatment steps. Molecule "N" floats back into the water supply and now a different person drinks some water from the city water supply. They have had a very low dose of a medication not suppllied by a doctor or pharmacist. Now think about if 1% of the people in a city are taking the medication for a month. Pretty freaky eh! Ok, take care.

*****

Subject: Atheism vs. Agnosticism
I think I may have e-mailed you on this topic once before but I don't remember. I saw a letter from an agnostic challenging atheism on the grounds that just because he hasn't seen a six legged purple deer, it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. He claimed that atheism is a positive declaration that there is no god, when this isn't necessarily so.

Theism is the belief in the existence of a god or gods. Atheism is simply the lack of a belief in a god or gods. Because the atheist makes no positive statement of belief, he has no need to provide evidence to disprove anything. It is the responsibility of the personwho HAS the positive belief in a god to provide evidence to support his claim. It is for this reason that no one goes around challenging you or me to prove that bigfoot doesn't exist. As a nonbeliever in bigfoot mythology we expect to see direct evidence from those who DO believe before we even waste our time trying to refute them.

And as for agnosticism, this argument is such an obvious fallacy that I'm amazed that anyone still claims to believe in it. Agnosticism is the belief that the nature as well as the very existence of the supernatural is inherently unknowable. It is not the commonly believed middle-ground between atheism and theism, wherein a person can claim to "not be sure" and leave the debate. Ask a typical agnostic if he or she believes in God and the most common answers will be that they "don't know" or "cannot know". If they don't or can't know, that means
they do not have a theistic belief and are therefore atheists by the broad definition I gave before.

I know I'm not telling you anything you don't already know Bob, but I'd like to see this get onto one of your hate-mail sidebars. That guy Justin was looking for a battle on semantics and I think I gave him
one here.
Keep up the great work Bob.

David Pachon

May 16, 2005 4:22:32 AM EDT
You repeatedly use the word logic.  No offence but I find that people who usually think themselves the most logical are actually completely irrational.

Subject: Interesting, but just weird

Where to start, I have read through your site a little and find it amusing being an agnostic that swings athiest sometimes.  Be careful though, I see this time in history as being more on edge then it has been for the last 40 years or so.  I, due to various problems have fallen in with the health crazed crowd and truely believe that our government is more corrupt now then it has ever been.  Along with this and the evil perpetuated by the FDA, pharma corps, mass production farming, and junk food industry.  I truely believe that america and many people who live the american lifestyle are truely insane out of their mind, because of all the poorly understood chemicals in their diet.  Your website will either help protect all our freedoms which I am all for or aid in the ignition of modern day religious crusades.  Just look at Bush, his politics, Iraq, and the hysteria you are causing with a harmless picture.  I believe Bush to be a danger to us all.  There are self proclaimed christians out there who could kill you for your beliefs, but I am sure you know this.  Anyways, just be careful and use your common sense

I look at religion as being good for those who need it and useless for those who don't.  The bible IMHO is nothing more then the rephrasing of the golden rule repeadedly for those who just don't get.  The whole point is to strive to be the best you can be and to try to improve this world for all, including plants and animals (mother earth).

The whole point that all good religions are trying to drive is this ideal.  To go further though I think that actions speak louder then words and that if there is indeed a god that no matter what you believe he will only allow those into heaven who do their very best to be the best all round people they can be.  In this I mean that people need to open their eyes and truely try to see the big picture.  Doing something that you think is good, but really isn't good doesn't count.  If he doesn't let these people in then I say do as Conan does with krom.  I could go on forever.  Anyways my younger brother who is seriously fanatical in his faith, has annoyed me to the point that I have been searching the web looking for something that I hope will open his eyes.  This is how I found your site.  I also found a link that I think is truely interesting.  http://www.churchofreality.org/wisdom/  Take a look if you get a chance. 
 
Next up, I can't begin to guess what you are like IRL, but I hope that you have values and that you believe that there is indeed good reason to do good.  Rather then, as I see it spend your time distroying others hard work as many today are doing.  It takes so much more to create and is much to easy to destroy.  All round you sound like a decent human being, but I have to wonder if you only spend your time tearing others down.  What I mean is, do you try to inspire others to try to better their lives and others?  This is a serious question.  Perhaps its answer will do more to open the eyes of supposed true believers, then Jesus bashing.  That or it will paint you as evil. 
 
One last thing on my mind.  You repeatedly use the word logic.  No offence but I find that people who usually think themselves the most logical are actually completely irrational.  Case in point my father(engineer), very smart man, but when you put him together as a whole he is a complete moron, as tends to be the case with people who spend to much time around machines.  I believe that the smartest most well adjusted people will consider themselves cool, collected, and rational (nearly all the time).  Able to step back and see the big picture, along with themselves in it and deal with whatever comes their way.  Logical makes me think of a machine, humans are not machines.  We are not efficient, we can be effective, but efficient is inhuman.  From my readings I would say that you sound more rational then logical.  You are ok with admitting that what you do is based upon your perception of reality (it is just your oppinion), not that you see the pure absolute truth.  You care that your getting a clear picture.  Logic is easily distortable, since most everything is open to interpretation.  You can only be logical if you believe that there is only one right way to do things, which there rarely if ever is.  Logic is thought without wisdom, being rational is a culmination of both.  Just thought I would point this out to you.  This is just my oppinion FYI :)   Don't know if this will even make sense.
 
I am a bad speller, so please do not pick it apart as I didn't use a spell checker.  The whole point of words is communication, not the perfection of it or lack there of.  As long as you can understand what someone is trying to say, that is all that really matters.  Though I am all for teasing people who make absolutly no sense. 
Anyways, here is to my boredem.
 
IN THE END, LEAD BY A GOOD EXAMPLE, WHATEVER THAT MAY BE!

Phil Stalheim
raistlin007@machlink.com

May 21, 2005 6:35:17 AM EDT
Stand up and awaken, open your fucking eyes.  You may be chained fool, but it is not by a god.  WAKE UP!

Subject: Third Email now. Maybe the rant format will get your attention better. You don't have the balls to read this one through.

As I have said before, I am agnostic. 
 
That said, you seriously need to step back and look at yourself.  I don't give a rats ass about your dress up jesus, what gets me is the fact that you are harrasing people and posting it on your page.  What gets me is how blind you are to your own stupidity.  Stop picking on people who are dumber then you.  Sure, I find your over all site mildly amusing.  Partly because I agree with some of it, but also because you remind me of people who go on Jerry Springer's show.  You are nothing more then a whiner begging for any and all attention, 
 
You believe yourself to be reducing people's faith, but I wonder if you have ever even stoped to think for a moment.  Don't you think maybe that you have probably affirmed many peoples faith by making it easier to believe in evil?  I mean come on, you even dress up like a christians image of satan. 
 
You are increadibly bitter, almost as if you really feel let down by a god that by my account does not exist.  I would even go so far as to say that you are consumed by bitterness.  You make many assumptions that god would provide a perfect book that would include everything, such as the dinosaurs and use that as a form of evidence. 
 
Let me state my view.  If god existed I would spit on him for what he has done.  I am not sure who I would consider worse, god or satan.  God as he is portrayed in the bible, I dub a sadistic hypocrite.  He would have to prove to me that he is worthy of me as a follower.  Now, that said, I would assume that if there was an all knowing all powerful being, he would indeed be great.  To me the greatest evidence of all that there is no christian god is the horrible amount of injustice in this world.  How could a being so great watch what he created torture each other and do absolutly nothing?  You seem to put an awful lot of blame on a being that does not exist in my mind.  Which I would call insanity.  If god exists he doesn't give a rats ass about you.  Take responsibility for your life.  Stop acting like you are helpless to yourself.  Do you really want to grow old and die being more hated then loved? 
 
You have talent, so stop wasting it, and put your creative juices to something more productive.  For example the injustices commited by the wealithiest people on this planet.  There are things that are being and have been done that are totally unacceptable.  The less rich are not cattle, nor are we slaves.  We are not to be butched for profit.  We are not to be poisoned, lied to, or turned into sick miserable and ineffectual zombies.  Educate yourself and everyone you meet so that they have the knowledge to protect themselves and the ones they love.
 
Due to my own dilemma, I believe I have found at least a few answers to many of todays problems.  Our generation has been lied to and filled with toxic crap that fogs the mind and clouds the senses.  No intellegent doctor will ever claim to truely understand the human body and yet we have allowed ourselves to be convinced that it is smart to tamper with our food and the things we consume.  The average human lifespan is actually decreasing in our great country, I wonder why.  Did you know the average doctor lives to the ripe old age of 57 or 58?  Look it up.  Did you know that most of the drugs put out by the pharma corps (one of the most powerful industries on this planet) are outright poison.  All cholesterol lowering drugs slowly chew up the brain (which is mostly made up of fat).  Fat and cholesterol are closely related.  This is just small potatoes compaired to the other torment and torture dished out by this industry and its close allies over the years.  Check out the neurotoxin fluoride, many times more destructive to the human brain then lead.  Any and all amounts are absolutly and completly toxic.  Small doses won't outright kill you, but damn it fucks people up good. 
 
The more miserable people are, the less productive they become.  Well, you sound miserable to me man and I am telling you how you can fight back and regain the ability to feel the joy of just being alive.  You want answers, they are right in your face.  This is your last chance, cause talent or not.  I have better things to do then email a complete stranger who is to helpless to heal themself.
 
Stand up and awaken, open your fucking eyes.  You may be chained fool, but it is not by a god.  WAKE UP!

Phil Stalheim
raistlin007@machlink.com

Don't give a rat's ass about Jesus Dress Up?!?!?! How is that possible?!? EVERYONE cares about Jesus Dress Up!! Didn't you know that? Either you really really love it because it's so in the face of those Christian nutsos. Or you hate it because you're one of those Christian nutsos! In either case I get lavished in warm, desirable attention! Good or bad, it doesn't matter to me! It's all attention! Oh sweet attention! I crave you so! Don't make me beg!!!

Wait! You would spit on God if He existed?!? Holy macaroni! Even I'm not THAT angry at Him! In fact, if God did exist not only would I NOT spit on Him, I'd bow down and kiss His perfect omnipresent feet! I mean, hell, I wouldn't care if I spent my whole life blind, deaf, acne scarred and handcuffed to an angry zoo gorilla, because I've got eternal paradise waiting for my sorry ass! ETERNAL PARADISE, PHIL! I'd lick God's feet clean of all His enemy's blood, including yours! I'm no fool!

But dammit Phil, I am not so lucky as you. I cannot be the fun-loving, carefree fence-sitter that God has blessed you to be, with your fluoride conspiracies, Pharma-corps and food tampering billionaires (I can just imagine the exciting game page I'd dream up for that site)! No. I am a slave to the system, consumed by bitterness, wallowing in my own miserable existence, veiled by a convincing charade of silly comics, dress up kiddy games, sarcastic hate mail retorts and an out-of-date tuxedo two sizes too small. No wonder I've been so unproductive and have so little to show for the last five years! I thought I was reducing believer's faith, but instead I'm horrified to learn that I've only affirmed them. Damn their stubborn asses! Now if you don't mind I have to draw another busty naked lady and take pictures of funny looking people in the summer sun. Phil! Get me out of this nightmare I'm forced to call a full time job!

Bob

P.S. You don't swallow the toothpaste, silly!

There is still debate over whether fluoride has ANY benificial effects.

First of all, I realize that we have very different philosophies in life.  You should realize this too if you don't already.  Many of these people you claim to not understand, view life and feel life in a very different way then you or I.  This is what makes us all different as individuals.  My interest, because of some very negative past experiences, has been in how you can change who people are through vitamins, minerals, amino acids, foods, herbs, and any other naturally occuring beneficial chemical that the body is capable of healthfully utilizing.  Most pharmaceutical drugs cause side effects because they are litterally at odds with the way our bodies work.  For many reasons that I am not gonna go into. 
 
I believe everything people put in their mouths affects who they are as a person.  We ARE chemicals, or as I like to say "Chemical Soup".  To think that what we eat has no effect is like believing that if you believe poison isn't poison it will all be ok.  I am not talking about fluoride in particular here.  Some things have a bigger impact then others.  What I advocate is that people educate themselves so that they can, at the very least, make an educated decision.
 
If you know nothing about fluoride then of course you will have nothing against it.  For the record, you should know that your mouth is very porous.  Many things that you consume get into your blood moments after you put it in your mouth.  This is why subligual vitamins work so well.  Which are ment to be sucked and absorbed by the membranes of your mouth.  In fact we absorbe many things far better in the mouth then we do in our digestive track.  If you read about the element fluoride you will run across information that verifies this.  There is still debate over whether fluoride has ANY benificial effects.
 
Fluoride has been baned from the water of many countries all across the globe over the last 20 years, but here in the US we are still being more and more fluorinated.  The US is the most fluorinated place on the planet.  No where else even comes close.  Dude, if you can't find the time to read through some helpful information, honestly that is your problem and not mine.  I took the time to recommend it and the fact that you have difficulty learning sometime new is not something I haven't experianced before.  It will leave you open to the truck barreling down on you.  Knowledge gives you the ability to see and understand things that you would be totally blind to otherwise.  Whether it is all a conspiracy, *shrug* I dunno.  I am not a billionaire, so, since there is only so much I can do about it, I try to not think about it that much. I will probably leave this country along with many other people who are doing the same, in the future.  As I grow, learn, and litterally achieve my objectives many people sadly do look more and more like sad drooling morons to me.  They could be so much more.  I feel sorry for them, but if they won't listen then there is nothing anyone can do.  My main interest is team work learning amoung close family and friends.  Everyone else, well, they can distroy themselves if they really want to.  Just as long as they don't take away my personal rights or affect me directly.  I do what I can though.
 
There are still alot of people who are perfectly capable of doing something, but many of them are sleeping.  A vast number of them are the older generations.  Walk up to any rancher or farmer who looks like they have it together and ask them questions.  They will tell you straight up all kinds of information you never would have even thought of otherwise.
 
As to your accomplishments, did I not say that you are indeed talented?
 
And oh yes, dude, YOU CAN BE FUN LOVING!  Though I would refere to it more as just plain loving life.  The human body is truely amazing, it is a long hard road, but it can happen.  I am living proof!  I spent nearly a full year near death in 2001 because I just didn't care and meds I tried made me even worse.  Then I told the mainstream doctors to go to hell and started looking for answers else where.  Now, all I can say to sick people everywhere is FIGHT FOR YOUR RIGHTS!  FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT!  LEARN LEARN LEARN!  DON'T EVER ACCEPT LESS, ACCEPT ONLY THE BEST!          NEVER SAY DIE!
 
America is a land of decadence.  The general masses are sick and weak. 
 
What I strive for is a state of balance, peace, and harmony.  Along with as much energy and strength as I can get naturally and healthfully. 

Finally, I think it is funny that you mock me.  I will assume that you are in some way being truthful when saying "I cannot be the fun-loving".  Because Bob, I truely believe in my heart that everyone can be better and it is by mixing cutting edge technology and grandmas wise advice.  Throughout your site I swear you allude to the fact that life let you down some where and still is.  Correct me if I am wrong.  Did you even get my 2 other emails?  They had links in them, many filters kill emails with links.
 
Hell, I am only fired up about fluoride because I spent all last tuesday researching the hell out of it to try to learn more.  Otherwise I wouldn't even be thinking that much about it.  Some of the stuff I read made me madder then hell.  I found your site around the same time.  I once found this retarted psychology site while looking up tips by Arnold Schwarzenegger.  I was like, "what the hell."
 
I could go on for pages and pages as I am sure you can see.  Honestly, I didn't really expect a response.  But I figured that if anything, sounding a little like the typical people you respond to might pull your chain.  You are seriously obsessed with that Jesus doll.  Not that your the only one.  Dolls are for girls. :p 

Phil Stalheim
raistlin007@machlink.com

Phil, what YOU don't understand is that you can't just expect everybody at a moments notice to just hop on whatever kick you're on at any given moment... unless you have some sort of dress up game to hook 'em into it. That's just how life works. I'm not sure how much clearer I can put it. People need dress up fun pages to get them on conspiracy bandwagons. Everybody knows this!

Like for instance, you will need to take this fluoride thingy that your mind has locked onto and dream up some sort of unhappy tooth/fluoride scientist dress up game page, post it on the web and link it to these fluoride manifestos you've been emailing me. THEN when the hate mail starts comin' in from fluoride supporters you respond to them with sarcastic, smart aleck retorts and post them on your site! After a while you'll discover that you're getting tons of hits, people will start demanding a fridge magnet version of your dress up game, Urban Outfitters will carry 'em, you'll make the news and then you'll become an official web-celebrity!

But until then you're just going to be another web browsing peon pushing your humorless whim-of-the-week onto jaded web celebrities who'll only use you as fodder on their dress up theme site.

I don't make the rules! I'm only a messenger!

So when you get your idea for this dress up page let me know and I'll gladly quote you a price and time frame for building you one of your very own. Coincidentally they're my specialty!
Bob
normalbobsmith.com/design/

Lets just say that I recently failed myself on an experiment that changed me in a way that set me back about a month.  I got a little off base with my goals.

LOL!  What you don't get is that to me fluoride is just a tiny fish in the pond.  You also don't understand that in all reality I don't give a flying fuck what other people do.  If they distroy themselves then that is their business. 
 
Lets just say that I recently failed myself on an experiment that changed me in a way that set me back about a month.  I got a little off base with my goals.  Browsing the web outside of health, money, or news is a waste of my time.  Helping people when I should be thinking clearly enough to realize that they are not candidates is also a waste.  Peace.
 
Don't email me again.
Phil Stalheim
raistlin007@machlink.com

Why didn't you tell me that? I had no idea you recently failed yourself on an experiment and changed yourself, setting you back a month... in this self-experimentation... that you're doing there on yourself... in private, alone, experimenting on yourself.

If I'd have known that I wouldn't have taken everything you said so personally!
Okay then. I hope you get all those things back on base again in the coming months. Don't worry. You won't be hearing from me again.

Bye bye Phil.
Take care.
No need emailing me either. I think I'm moving and my email's gonna change and the site too. So no need for you to visit it again! Heh heh...

So long!
*Gulp*
Bob

 

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