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The Rebekah Lee files.
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Subject: I just went to court ordered church!!!!!

My experience at a Drug/Alcohol Rehab program called S.A.V.E.D.

In my mind I can picture a middle-aged bleach frizzy blonde over weight redneck screaming her fucking head off for the lord. Her fake nails waving in the air as if she was begging for help from some far off place. I was only able to make out a few words, "JESUS, THANK YOU JESUS!!!" My eyes enlarging in fear, I wondered 'Who is this woman?'. A biker looking man, the speaker up on the podium was saying "This court house is now a house of god!" My mind went into panic; I was literally scared my friend and I would be used in an exorcism. What was happening, was this government building being taken over in a matter of minutes by this church going folk? The answer, fuck yes it was and there was nothing I could do about it! I literally felt as if I was on another planet, I was a prisoner to be kept and converted. Sarah York, my friend had her head lowered onto the bench in front of us, she was trying to shield herself from all the bible preaching which was going on. Why were we being forced by law to watch this woman screaming for god??? Why was I sitting in fear trying to figure out why I was attending court appointed church?? What happened to the constitution and my rights?

Then my head went back to when I was standing in front of a judge who was to tell me what money I owed them for being drunk in public with my friend Sarah, beside me stood the County's Prosecuting Attorney. July 7th at 7p.m. my friend and I truly found out what illegal things were going to happen, and in all places a government courthouse. We had no clue how severe of an issue 'god' would be, it turned out to be the only issue. Remember as you read this I was ordered by the court to take these Alcohol/Drug Abuse classes hosted by the program S.A.V.E.D. I was informed the day of my court appearance that if I failed to appear for these classes a warrant would be issued for my arrest. I would go to jail if I hadn't gone to this class; this is what I cannot get of my mind. As Sarah and I walked up to sign our names, she asked him "What are we going to be doing-watching movies?" Kennis Maynard (Kentucky County Attorney) replied back "We're gonna help ye, believe it or not were going to teach you about god." Believe it or not huh? I was forced soon to believe his words regardless if I wanted to or not. Our jaws dropped.... simply our breath stopped. My head lowered again, you know I'm aware I don't get surprised often...but the extent of the stupidity and selfishness of ignorance seems to never stop surprising me. My friend rightfully so added, "I'm an atheist, this isn't going to help me." As he rolled his eyes around in his fat head he said, "Your too young to know what you believe in, how can you not believe in god just look around ye." I did, and what I saw was a bunch of drug addict alcoholic's mumbling around...wow god's beauty was sooooo apparent in this room if this was the extent of god's beauty I couldn't understand why more people aren't atheists. How dare he talk to her this way, for one any discussion on religion is illegal in this class...and here this man sat proud and stern with 'god' to tell her she didn't know how she felt, he did. I waited for her to explode, or for him to say something so awful I would explode. Sarah's voice became more angry "I've always been an atheist this isn't going to help me, I've died three times and there wasn't anything there!" Ignoring her statement he rudely said, "Well where do you think you came from?" as if this question was the question to prove god was real. His rudeness inspired my friend to be a smart ass right back, "My mom and dad." Wow, this man was such a pompous judging asshole.

This situation is one reason in my mind why the "separation of Religion and Government", in our constitution. I knew in my brain what this man was doing was sooooo illegal, and he didn't care for anyone's opinion but his own. Did Kennis sit and wonder if what he was doing was illegal, I mean he is an Attorney for the entire county he should know shouldn't he? Did Kennis sit and wonder if anyone else had a different religion, or a lack of one? Now this class was supposed to be about drug and alcohol abuse, ways to overcome it...alcohol was really never mentioned...especially what it does to ones life. You'd think Alcohol/Drug Abuse programs would talk about the substance that's being abused, not in this class! The only topic on discussion *cough, well preaching time* was god...that's it and what happens to you in the afterlife if you drink and do drugs. No mention of health effects, what it does to the individual's family or anything at all involving what alcohol/drug abuse does to the life of anyone. All which was spoken of again, was god...just god. Some of the 'preacher's' couldn't even pronounce the names or places in the bible, and the other I literally quote said "I really don't know what I'm talking about, I'm just learning the bible I used to be a drug addict." Wow, cause a man who doesn't know what he's saying should be telling addicts how to run their lives...sounds like an awful ass backwards plan to me. He doesn't know what he's saying but he's instructing drug addicts...yea.

This one lady, I still don't know why she was there, she only introduced maybe two of the speakers. She chanted, threw her arms up, screamed to Jesus throughout the entire class, if you can call it that. Then out of the blue during a speaker's depressing story she begins insanely laughing as loud as possible while she turned her head like she was the fucking girl in the Exorcist. Her eyes looked as if they were going to pop out of her head, I was scared. I grabbed my shirt, turned to Sarah with my eyes huge, and asked "Sarah what the fuck, DID YOU SEE THAT??!!!??" Shouldn't Kennis a government worker be stopping this illegal activity? My head turned and there he was, sitting in the same row as Sarah and I as if nothing odd was going on at all. I was scared, I seriously admit it...I can't see how anyone sat through that like it was normal, like she was mentally ok. How is it people think were the freaks, I mean come on!! She was fucking crazy! One man, an ex-biker, who was more open minded but still I have to bash him for his selfishness said something which almost made me shit myself. I'm quoting him exactly "This court house is now a house of god!" I wished I had had a tape recorder, so I was able to record it and send it in to someone who runs the state! THIS SHIT IS 100% ILLEGAL!!!! I have no idea how many church songs were sung, and the singing was a heavenly blue grassy moment of bliss for them...seriously. They seemed so happy they looked crazy to me, seemed like they were faking it. I had previously only seen this kind of behavior in bad horror flicks. Of course every speaker had to tell us how much they all loved us, sooo much...of course just like god loves us. The speakers loved us so much that they participated in forced church because love forces you to listen I mean...right?

At the end of the session it was said they closed with a final group prayer at every class. Our asses stayed in the seat, I was not going to participate in prayer, and I hadn't participated to the many many times prayer was given. I could see everyone walking slow, checking us out from his or her side vision... I watched them. The room cleared, they were all in their spots waiting to join hands, and then the awkward staring came. One asked us to come up, and then Kennis ordered us to join. I put my hand up as if I was offered extra food at dinner and quietly said, "Nah, I'm good." Sarah added in much louder, "I'm an atheist, if I was to pray it would be false prayer and that would be a slap in gods face!" She was being really respectful in saying this, but we sure got the dirty looks. Then it began, a few of them chanting as loud as possible to save the non-believers...which were us if I need to point that out. When the thing was over we rushed out, and I felt as if I had been a freed slave from the clutches of white religious oppression. Really I felt liberated. But I was angry as fucking hell, and I mean angry. I'm so sick of the illegal church based way of things down here; hardly anything is legal at all! No one does a thing about it!!! I was beyond disgusted by the entire situation, beyond, the class I was forced to attend was Church and the law is allowing this! Only god was spoke of, that's it...these people have no regard for anyone else and their beliefs. It isn't right to force any religion on anyone in any way, especially when the government is the ball and chain in the situation. I was betrayed and so was everyone else in that room, no one got real help with their addiction, if anything the whole ordeal made me want to drink. Though when I went home, I didn't because I chose not to, not because I have god in my life.

We need help do what you can! My friend and I may be thrown back in jail for not participating in their prayer! Write the Kentucky Legislature.

Jennifer

Caitlin Horrigan (horrigan@au.org) on behalf of Madison Fellows (madison@au.org) someone to whom I reported the incident.

if you had the guts, you'd do it to Mohammad.

there may be many protests over this game, but don't toss them aside. even if you aren't a believer, you shouldn't antagonize Christianity. if you had the guts, you'd do it to Mohammad.

Rebekah Lee
rlzy@hotmail.com

Just call me Mr. Super Guts.
http://www.mohammeddressup.com/

Bob

aggravating religious groups doesn't seem to be a very good plan...

is this a business venture of any sort? aggravating religious groups doesn't seem to be a very good plan...

Rebekah Lee
rlzy@hotmail.com

“yes, you are mr. super guts.”

i just wanted to apologize for insinuating that you were gutless. it was quite low and not accurate at all. it's just my opinion that provoking religious groups is dangerous, both in the terrestrial and celestial sense, and quite unwarranted, too. yes, you are mr. super guts.

though many religions conflict, it is not put on you to make a mockery of it all because of sensitivity issues. i am a christian, and the way you mock jesus, it's almost like you mocking somebody that i'm proud of. i'm sure many muslims feel that way too. this point requires a degree of respect to be appreciated.
again, my apologies.

Rebekah Lee
rlzy@hotmail.com

I'm supposing you think the better plan is to simply continue to show this blanket respect for all the religions we invent no matter how demented, crazy, or even dangerous they can be?

Has that made the world a better place so far? Had it crossed your mind that perhaps strange beliefs that have no proof or logic to back them shouldn't be respected?

Bob

“atheistic websites are completely unfounded and show very shallow understanding (of christianity in particular).”

have you ever been in a religion? i'd be very happy to introduce what christianity is. those atheistic websites are completely unfounded and show very shallow understanding (of christianity in particular).

i know there are religious radicals. but i'm sure the parents who raised drug addicts never intended them to be drug addicts, just like God never wants us to sin. it is his ultimate love to us that he gave us free will, to choose, and to decide what paths we want to take. like a parent that sadly watches his son go astray, he ultimately wants us to be able to say 'i was able to choose, and this is what i have chosen'.

it's interesting to note how the Bible says "a fool in his heart says there is no god"
so why do you believe there isn't a God?

Becky
rlzy@hotmail.com

Yes, I was raised in a Christian home and believed as a child. I would say that the main reason I no longer believe there's a god is because he's clearly made up. There's just too much evidence that people made up different gods through the ages and around the world. Did you know there's been more than 4,000 gods invented since man has had the ability to make up gods? And yes, I include your Christian god in that number.

He also just doesn't make sense. The god you believe in condemns thought crimes (thinking things he doesn't approve of), and everyone knows that trying to control or censor your own thoughts is a one way ticket to the looney bin. Thinking things is not as wrong as acting on them, but to your god they're equal. That's clearly an idea made up by men looking to control others. Instructing people to obey without question and not trust their own logic and decision-making skills doesn't help society. In fact it promotes dictatorships. Not something a good god would endorse.

It also doesn't help any that the book you claim is the true, infallible word of god has so many mistakes, and make-believe sounding tales in it, like talking animals, 900 year old men, endorsements of slavery (Lev 25:44-46), sexual slavery (Exodus 21:7-11), God commanding the killing of children (Prov 13:24), and Jesus endorsing all of these Old Testament laws in the New Testament (Matt 5:18-19). It's just too many strikes against the Bible's supposed good intent and perfection.

The lack of evidence for your god (or any god) doesn't help your side either. If you were able to present any sort of evidence that couldn't be explained more reasonably in a scientific way you could at least get me to consider the hypothesis of god being real. Unfortunately the reasons you present to prove your god are the same ones every other religion presents to prove theirs, and none of it stands up to testing or even common sense in most cases.

Since it is the job of the person who suggests the existence of something to present the evidence (like Bigfoot, the Loch Ness Monster or spacemen), tell me at least one thing that proves your god exists so I can at least understand why you're so convinced.

Bob

“Slavery in the Old Testament was very different. In those days, slavery was not forced labour. Slaves sold themselves into work, with a contract, much like domestic help is nowadays.”

This is more to expand you perspective of how to interpret the Bible than to concretely convict you.

I'm assuming you've given all this much thought before, as i have. You may have been a little too hasty to judge the Bible based on literal meanings, such as the technical flaws in the Bible such as the endorsements of slavery, sex slavery or killing of children. First and foremost, i think you will find that the Old Testament was written a long time ago. Circumstances change over time. What we now know as slavery is very different from the slavery the Old Testament mentions. We know slavery as what the Europe and the United States of America have made the term C forced labour with little or no pay, and few rights. Slavery in the Old Testament was very different. In those days, slavery was not forced labour. Slaves sold themselves into work, with a contract, much like domestic help is nowadays. There is pay, there are rights and there are rules to enforce them. Slavery was a way out of poverty for many people, and sex slavery, was in fact, more like dowry. In some countries, the husbands pay the dowry. That is what 'sex slavery' is. Social mobility. Marrying into a richer family, with money on the side. They are not treated badly, but as daughters are. And in fact, killing a child in Proverbs 13:24, is not about killing a child. It is about disciplining a child. The rod is akin to a cane.

If you want a reason why i believe, i'd say because i can feel God's presence. But knowing how that just doesn't sit well with many people, i'd like to use creation as my justification of my loony behaviour. Consider the world (and the universe). Consider the fragility of the environment while considering the magnificence of the scale of the universe. How do you explain the complexity of the universe? Evolution? Big bang? According the advocates of the Big Bang, the universe came from nothing (which in itself suggests the presence of a God) It started off with hydrogen, then helium, and then somewhere along the lines there came the other elements, the first signs of life, earth, and at the end of it all, us. I'm assuming you think this is all random.

So according to that, randomness accounts for something out of nothing. I'm also assuming you think this claim is stupid, given your logic.

Science has taken a hit. One to Creationism.

Well, assume that you have all the up quarks and down quarks and protons and neutrons and basically, imagine you have mass. Assume you have energy to assemble it.

So now, with you mess of atoms, build a universe.

The odds creating a single-celled amoeba from a mess of atoms and energy is like having a junkyard of metal and blowing it around with a giant fan until it forms a working jumbo jet. Take your time. We haven't yet dated the universe. Just keep blowing the metal around, something is bound to happen.

Have we ruled out randomness yet? If we have, then we are left with design. Now who does this design come from? Well i say God.

God always has his reasons. Likening thought to action is holding our character accountable. It is possible to control our thoughts, and whatever we are in control of, we are likely to held accountable for. God does not prohibit our intellectual quest for knowledge. For example, when God prohibits free sex, don't you believe it serves some purpose other than upholding morality? If we had abided by God's law on sexual morality, there wouldn't be sexually transmitted diseases, or inbreeding. We wouldn't even have AIDS. God promotes an ideal world. I think we can both accept that the world is not ideal.

Neither does God want blind faith. God wants us to do what we can to the best of our abilities without compromising on our character, and then to let Him do the rest. I'll share just a story with you, you might call it coincidence, but that's just up there for you.

Everytime i lose something, i never find it. One day, i got so frustrated i attacked my own worth. I had a calling from the Lord and i promised Him that everytime i lost something, i would go back to Him in prayer. Ever since, everytime i lost something, i'd never find it until i pray, then almost at once i would receive and epiphany. Then last week, i lost something which didn't belong to me. Immediately, i prayed. For three months after, i couldn't find it. I prayed harder and harder, but i never lost hope. I never lost hope because i had faith that since God has been gracious to me and helped me through harder things, that i would not limit Him to my own faithlessness. So more time passes. At the crunch time, after having checked every possible place, everywhere, for three whole months, it turns up. I saved myself all the anxiety because i had faith.

I'm not saying that God acts in supernatural ways all the time. All i'm saying is faith need not be blind. Faith is useful. Faith is bigger than what you now conceive of it.

If you want to pursue other scientific proofs in the Bible, you might find this useful.
clarifyingchristianity.com/science.shtml

Becky
rlzy@hotmail.com

Slaves sold themselves into work? Sexual slavery was more like a dowery?? It's not about killing children!??!?

Lev. 25:44-46 "You may buy slaves from among the strangers who sojourn with you and their families that are with you and they may be your property." Buying people from other people, Beks! That's not slaves selling themselves and keeping the money like some sort of one time paycheck.
Exo. 21:7-11 "When a man sells his daughter as a slave the master may designate her for himself or his son." Pass her around! It's okay by God!
Exo. 21:20 "If a man beats his male or female slave with a rod and the slave dies as a direct result, he must be punished, but he is not to be punished if the slave gets up after a day or two, since the slave is his property." Sounds like beatings and abuse to me, Beks, with no punishment if the slave survives. Nice.
Lev. 20:9 "For every one that curseth his father or his mother shall be surely put to death: he hath cursed his father or his mother; his blood shall be upon him." Dead. Got it? Your god's commands.

These commands from your God are clear and direct, and Jesus, in the New Testament, orders you to respect and obey these Old Testament writings or "you will be the least in the kingdom of heaven." Matt 5:18-19

I'm not sure where you're getting your watered down, politically correct translation of the Bible, but these are direct quotes from scripture. We are talking about the same book (The Holy Bible), aren't we? If so, you have to tell me where it says in scripture that you're allowed to rewrite it to suit your own feelings about what you think is right and wrong even when it contradicts what God says.

How can you read these passages and not question its authenticity? How can you see what it's telling you to do and not question its righteousness?

 

And I'm sorry, but your theory of a complicated Universe-Making-Being coming from nothing is even more unlikely and illogical than matter coming from nothing. It's like saying a brick can't come from nothing, but a brick maker, his brick making machine, and all the ingredients to make a brick can??? How does that make more sense to you? Science has taken no hit from Creationism at all. Your theories are even more unwarranted and implausible.

This "junkyard of metal exploding to create a jumbo jet" argument is as old and tired as one gets. I'm talking about billions of years while you're talking about the 3 and a half minutes for exploding garbage to fall back on the ground. Analogy Error #1. I'm talking about a slow gradual building that starts at the most rudimentary elements and slowly evolves at an exhaustingly gradual rate just like the things around you change (trees, landscapes, the weathering of a building, expanding forests, etc). Not the immediate clamping together of sockets and bolts to construct your functional jumbo jet. Analogy Error #2.

Rebekah, you say that every time you lose something you cannot find it. But that wasn't true. Each time you've found it, after immediately praying. Now let me tell you I do not pray and yesterday I found my girlfriend's hoodie that we'd been searching for for weeks. I lost my debit card once, I didn't pray about it, and it turned up at my bank because I left it in the ATM. A Muslim person once lost something, prayed about it and found it. A Hindu person once lost something, prayed about it and found it. A Viking once lost something, prayed to Thor the God Of Thunder and then he found it. And I also bet you've lost something before, prayed, and it never turned up, ever. Imagine that. Try not praying several times and see if the something eventually turns up. I bet sometimes it will and sometimes it won't. Attibuting all good things that happen in your life to your god and bad things to you without your god proves nothing. It's the same outcome no matter what you believe. Praying Christians never lose things permanently? Puh-leeeze.

My favorite part is how you think your god cares if you lost your car keys, while at the same time He lets a baby get AIDS or allows a little girl to get raped by a stranger. If that isn't self-absorbed, world-revolves-around-me thinking then you're out of your mind. Do you not see how messed up that is?

Bob

do you know the ramnification of curses and blessings in the old testament?

do you know the ramnification of curses and blessings in the old testament? (i.e. not simple cussing.)

Rebekah Lee
rlzy@hotmail.com

Well, I'm supposing that since the people who originally wrote the bible believed in magic spells and hexes and other superstitious nonsense like that the ramifications of it were considered terrifyingly scary, like being turned into bats, making it rain frogs on your neighbor's house or giving your worst enemy the plague by zapping him with your pointy finger.

So yeah, I can clearly see why "God" would command us to put our own children to death for such a crime. A kid could accidentally set their mom or dad's soul on fire if the curses got out of hand!

Bob

 

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