More emails, more feuding and lots more Edward Britz.

Hey, if you haven't seen what everybody's shoutin' about you have to see the anti-Bob pages Ed put together!

Hey Bob, I emailed Ed about his web site too, and he's mean! Saying hurtful things in his response. I'm only 16! Just because I R Smrtr then him, doesn't mean he's got to be mean! Well, here is what I wrote and what he wrote back with:

Hey Ed, I'm a fan of Normal Bob Smith's website and I just had to read your "evidence" that God exists. I've read up to the third one, and I see, in no way, that any of that is evidence. It would not hold up in any court, and it is just mindless opinions.

"Evidence" #1: DNA
Scientists say that it is more and more unlikely that life could begin from nothing. That is what you state, is it not? Well, where did your Creator crawl out from? Has He just always been there? Is He energy based? I would have to guess so if He had the energy and power to create an entire universe! What created His energy? Personally, a big bang is more logical to me.

"Evidence" #2: Little Causality
I think the above covers this on too. What is God's "more original state"? You have no proof to the existence of God. There are more logical reasons out there for everything then a supernatural being that creates things with words.

"Evidence" #3: Hollywood's Double Standard I'm not going to lie, I only read the first part of this. Yes the universe has order. Maybe out in the vast galaxies, there is no order. There are some hundred billion galaxies, each with, on average, a hundred billion stars. In all the galaxies, there are perhaps as many planets as stars, ten billion trillion (try to imagine). Now, out of those planets, what is the likelihood of at least one supporting life? I would say pretty god damn good. If Earth didn't have life, we'd be on another planet asking the same questions. Maybe there are other life forms out there asking the same question right now. Just because we don't know how life started now doesn't mean it must be God. There is something for every generation to learn. In the distant future So look at the big picture, not just your little view of our solar system.

I'm not planning on reading the rest of it sense you aren't showing evidence at all.

Thank you for reading.
Keith T.

Keith,

I sincerely appreciate your taking the time to email me, so let me respond. The goal here is to show that you cannot prove that God does not exist. Read that twice. God is energy? You cannot confine a creator to what he created. I am a graphic designer. If my designs would talk, they would say, "What! Is 'god' made of some translucent ink?" Keith, you cannot expect to understand the infinite with a finite mind. What this argument means to say is that it is easier to believe that something intelligent (that we cannot expect to understand) created everything, than to say nothing created everything. The second argument takes this one step further. God can simply be eternal in all directions without requiring our understanding. But to go back for infinity, without beginning and without a creator is even harder to believe.

"Just because we don't know how life started now doesn't mean it must be God." I don't understand your point. The contrary is equally true. "I'm not planning on reading the rest of it since you aren't showing evidence at all." It seems that you already have a desire to not see evidence. Be honest with yourself, Keith. Be open. Never be afraid to challenge what you believe by reading others views. I encourage you to stay in touch.

Edward

I kind of liked his translucent ink thing though... I also found it funny how he tells me to be open minded, while he worships an empty room just because he was raised that way, and mocks you for believing otherwise.

Oh well. Talk to you later Bob..

Hello again Ed,

How are you doing? I'm thinking you are cowering for the end of the world right now, after Bob put it ever so well. And you commented on how some of the people who emailed you (like myself) have became offended and cut you off altogether. Well, I just wanted to let you know, I'm not offended by your child-like belief or how you've seemed to avoid the fact that your so called "evidence" is nothing more than near ravings of an empty room worshiper. In fact, I kind of enjoyed your response. You must have misunderstood why I stopped reading your page. It wasn't because I don't want to see the evidence, I want to see the evidence, it's because you weren't showing evidence to begin with! If you go though a newspaper and see something to spark your interest, then halfway though you notice it doesn't even come close to explaining the title of it, you are going to stop reading it. Why? Because it is poorly written. That is why I stopped. So stop your ego trip of thinking you've scared people. It is true, people get scared easily. I've realized this by driving around in my hearse and watching people freak out when I pull up next to them. But giving them your point of view won't do shit. Now I'm ranting, I feel just like you. I'm going to shut up now because I've lost my train of thought, and go do what all other stereotypical non-Christians do and shoot up some cocaine.

Thank you for your time again,
Keith T

Thank you again for your time,
Keith T. .

Keith, I am glad you wrote back! So, no, you are no longer one of those whom I put on my "too scared to respond" list. My apologies for the pre-judgement. I am also glad that I did not offend you, though I don't know how I could have.

"So stop your ego trip of thinking you've scared people." I, er ... well, I don't get an ego trip from scaring people, nor was that my intent. I am just presenting the truth. I get an "ego trip" from knowing that the God of the universe would rather die than live without me. Now if that doesn't give you a feeling of self-worth, nothing will.

Furthermore, if you are already absolutely certain that you know the truth, what opposes your view should not scare you anyway. And for that reason, I do not see myself as "cowering" from Bob's very own brainchild's, though somewhat eloquent and satirical they may be. Let me clear up some of your misconceptions.

The Bible never says that God has a "form." Praying louder or longer does not increase your chances of getting the answer you want. I updated my entire website last week so those "secret" pages, as Bob calls them, were down for that period of time. I assure you, they have been up for almost a week now, though somewhat trimmed to better get to the point. But thanks for checking up on me. My "evidences" are written at a basic level. I did not intended that someone as well read as you would go to them. But I will continue to add to them. Maybe one might even challenge you.

About your God-energy theory. You are attempting to fit God into your human understanding. If there is a God who created the universe and all that is in it, don't you think it is a little fool hardy to simply assume he is some photon containment field of energy? I mean, God would have created energy. He does no have to be energy. If you were blind from birth, there would be no way for me to describe the color green to you because in your dark world, you would have nothing to reference it to. You are trying to do the same with God. You want to cross reference him with something that your 5 senses can detect. God could have made 6 senses ... or 1000 senses. He decided to give you 5, and with those 5 you are attempting to understand him? Jack, Jack, Jack. You know better than that. Look, I have to run. Debating about God's existence is not my full time job either, but I would welcome a response from you if you have the energy ... no pun intended.

So, how was the cocaine trip? Too bad the real world is always waiting for you when you return, hey? There is a peace and contentment that God offers so that you don't feel you have to leave reality. Knowing where I will be in 100 years,

Edward Britz.

Subject: Well, well, well ...

Bob,

Still at it? That's nice ...
I have received a few emails from people willing to debate the ubiquitous question, "Does God exist?" Flustered by all the sudden attention, I went to your site and I saw that you, Bob Smith, had put me on your front page. What's a guy to say but, "It's about time." I appreciate the sentiment and am enjoying the opportunities it has afforded me; though I must admit, and not that I am ungrateful, but all but 2 of the emails that I received were sort of ... well, for lack of a better word, "whiny;" emotion-laden responses that misunderstood some of the more basic parts of the evidences I had posted. Some became easily offended and have cut me off altogether. This generation is dissapointing ..

And then again, perhaps I was not clear enough, or too tongue-in-cheek, but I will accept the blame and rely on setting straight the misconceptions of those who take the time to email me. Not to worry, Bob.I regret that I will not be able to write directly to Steven Thrasher or the nameless girl who had a lot to say for lack of email addresses. No matter.

I am honored that I elicited such ... lengthy responses. Bob, I wish you well in your pursuit for truth. If you follow the pattern of those before you, it will get more intense as you approach the inevitable. Just remember that a good gambler should always hedge his bets. If you're right and I'm wrong, I have lost nothing. But if I am right and you are wrong, you have lost everything.

Enjoying forgiveness, acceptance and security,
Edward Britz.
ejdiaz@chartermi.net

Well well well.... Ed has finally contacted me about his secret pages that were built so long ago then made to go away until a fan sent me the Google cache links. Were you scared to show me the pages you posted? And now you come groveling back begging for more attention from the atheist we all know that you love so dearly... because your GOD makes you love me. HA HA HA! Another lie you are forced to pretend. Another impossible feat that a believer must fake or they will pay with eternal damnation. Another perversion of proper human behavior that doesn't work in real life.

This Ed is what you lose. You lose your life. This is the worst fate of all because it was the only one that you had and you spent it living to a set of directions that don't work. No, I'm not talking about the obvious directions like "Thou shalt not kill" or "Gay is bad". I'm talking about things like "faith before logic being a virtue" and "give your responsibilities to God instead of doing it for yourself". Even something as simple as making people feel guilty for not being able to believe the unbelievable is a dreadful thumbtack to put in a shoe. You'll have been no better than Marshall Applewhite, wasting other people's lives by telling them to ignore that which makes sense and have faith in a fairy tale. Jesus Christ, you'll have told children that to question it is a sin. What could be worse than actually promoting ignorance to the children? The ones who Jesus loves most!

Ed, you will have lost the luxury of learning how we really evolved and the true meaning of life. You will have never had true knowledge and passed it down to your loved ones. Instead of believing science with its dinosaur bones and medical breakthroughs you will still be left wondering if we were even correct in declaring the earth round. You'll have succumbed to confusion and accepted its ills with open arms.

Hell, you'll have spent your life thinking the snake had its legs taken away because it tempted Eve in the garden. There is no worse fate than looking the obvious fool. At least when I die I'll have the luxury of scolding God for taking the "Mother Goose" route instead of simply meeting me face to face so that I could truly know the value He puts on my eternal soul.

Watch out Ed! Any day now that seven headed dragon could come swooping from the sky to eat your baby, and the horsemen to trample your lawn furniture. Run to the hills because it could even be TODAY! Crouch in the bushes and fear that falling sky because fear is the backbone of religion. And unfortunately you'll have never understood that fear was indeed the most important obstacle to overcome in life.

You'll have lived with the misconception that this life is minute compared to the everlasting one that follows. This is all you'll have lost.

Oh! And your name will be Mud.

Bob

Well, well, well ... Bob,

I appreciate your well-thought, from-the-heart response. It is indeed a compliment. I never meant to take those pages off-line permanently. They were down for about a week as I revamped my website. They are back on-line now. They have been for a few days now. I revamped them to, however. A little less Bob-slamming, a little more to the point. I don't have to like you Bob, but I am called to love you in Jesus name. So, this I do. Yes, it is near impossible without God's help. But believe me, there are harder people to love out there. You are not as difficult as you may think.

About faith and logic. I have gained life, Bob. Human logic is unimpressive and erroneous. Laden with manipulating human emotion and dependent on the unimpressive ignorant human view of the universe around him. We are too small, too short lived to have a respectable logic, Bob. Now ... God is older than me. I can only assume he knows more than me. I will have faith in his logic. After what I have seen in my short existence, I will take a chance on God's ideas because they leave me without the consequences that human logic brings.

Questioning Jesus is a sin? Sheesh Bob. Following God means I hang my brains up at the door? Really, I don't think you believe this. You are running Bob. Bringing up extremes to help you be more certain that you are not making a mistake and leaving behind what can truly liberate you from yourself and that nagging feeling that says you could be wrong.

Your email to me was full of intensity. Something was inspiring you to write such an involved email. Like the nameless girl on your website. I think you are trying to convince yourself as much as you are trying to convince me. But to accept what you believe, with all its loneliness, insecurities and uncertainties, is a downgrade for me, and I will not accept.

Bob. You may not believe this, but I do have a genuine concern for you. "Run to the hills because it (the second Coming, capital "C") could even be TODAY!" For your sake I hope you're wrong here.

You are taking big chances under the false pretense that you can enjoy your life more if you chose your own destiny. I'm telling you, your search for meaning will only get more desperate as life daily reminds you that it is temporary and as what is "fun" gets old and has to be replaced with yet another "fun" thing. How empty.

But, you smell a foul smell long enough, you don't notice the stench anymore.

Bob, I will continue to add evidences to those "secret" pages. Maybe the next one will focus on dinosaurs ... who knows?

But I will sign off for now. I must admit, you have been an inspiration that has grounded me further in my faith.

Happy searching.
Peaceful because my future is secure,
Edward Britz.
ejdiaz@chartermi.net

What if I were to use your same "Human logic is unimpressive and erroneous" statement but point it towards Edward Britz and his ability to "logically" explain Adam, Eve and a talking snake... that was possessed by Satan? Wouldn't you say that we are too small and too short lived to have a respectable logic and your explanation of what went down in Eden would prove that? Are you telling me that we have just enough logic to know God is real but not enough to look for answers ourselves?

You are now starting to sound like a cult member Ed. You see, I am arguing that I don't think God exists and the Bible was written by humans (not God), then in return you say "God is older than me. I can only assume he knows more than me. I will have faith in his logic."

I don't mind you behaving like this because showing people how you debate your viewpoint exposes who you are and how you think. It also shows what can happen to someone when they commit to believing the unbelievable. You start to tell people that they can't even trust the back of their own hand. You start saying things like: "I know that God is real because He is so much older than me and smarter than me and according to Him He is VERY real."
No kidding, this is really what starts happening when you completely submit to something that doesn't make sense. I know because what's happening to you is what happened to me. My own thought process started to cave in on itself as I tried to make it all make sense.

It's a little painful to watch you struggle through your thought process but it is necessary to show you do it so that others can bear witness to what being trapped in confusion really looks like.

You've unknowingly hung your brains up at the door, you just don't know it yet because they're still there. And that is the "peace" you feel.

Bob

Bob,

A few things to clear up first:

"I am arguing that I don't think God exists..." Bob, what you think is irrelevant when proving truth. What you mean to say is, "I am arguing that God cannot exist" and I, myself, am arguing that God cannot not exist.

"Are you telling me that we have just enough logic to know God is real but not enough to look for answers ourselves?" No, that's not what I am telling you.

"God is older than me. I can only assume he knows more than me. I will have faith in his logic." Be careful when you quote me that you do not take my words out of context. I was not using that to prove his existence but to contrast God-logic with human-logic. Let us be clear on that one.

I appear to be a cult member?

a. A religion or religious sect generally considered to be extremist or false, with its followers often living in an unconventional manner under the guidance of an authoritarian, charismatic leader.

b. Obsessive, especially faddish, devotion to or veneration for a person, principle, or thing.

Well ... I really don't know what to say except that you, yourself are an outgoing, charismatic person, "extremely" "obsessed" with avoiding all the evidence that points to intelligent design because some non-existent God let you down and it is bothersome that there are Jesus followers out there that have not been let down. So long as there are, you may wonder if you were missing something when you, allegedly, were a "Christian." Your encouragement to go on comes from, though is not limited to, those devoted to your site.

Come on Bob! Two can play these little games. But I don't enjoy them as much as you do.

Now to the real issue:

If there is a God, the real comparison is the condition of your soul and the condition of mine. If there is no God, then ... you need to lower your expectations so that this life alone actually entertains you ... until tragedy strikes, of course. Life and health are shaky things to depend on for purpose and happiness, but ... more power to you, Bob.

I have read many of your fan mails. I have perused the biographical information of many who admire you, and their lives don't seem to exemplify purpose, significance, acceptance, satisfaction, peace ... love. I mean, they (you) really have nothing to offer me. But let us break life down shall we?

According to Chuck Colson in his book, "Gideons Torch" you have three logical conclusions in life, Bob:

1. You can believe in the absolute truth, that there is a God, that you can be accepted by him through a way he provided. Life has purpose, significance, you are accepted. ... life
2. You can deny the truth, you are a cosmic accident, that there is no absolute right and wrong, that life has no purpose beyond your short existence, that regardless of what you do, how you live, you will be forgotten and eventually die. You either wait out death or do the only honest thing, suicide.
3. You can ignore the truth, the fact that you will die by keeping yourself busy life's short-term offers of satisfaction, money, power, sex, fun, what have you, because if you spend too much time trying to understand the inevitabilities and complexities of life, you will go insane.

So there you have it Bob. Life, death/suicide, or madness. Of all the evidence for and against God's existence, it, once again, is in your best interest to give the evidence the benefit of the doubt.

Edward Britz.
ejdiaz@chartermi.net

At this point it has become unavoidably obvious that you've moved beyond any sort of logical, coherent discussion. I have to tell you that I no longer respect your ability to think or reason in any way. So what I am going to do is readily accept your suggestion that I could be a cult leader and summon my minions to turn against you and your very real God.

So I command you, my followers, to deny the obvious truth (we are all related to Adam & Eve Noah & his wife, prehistoric fossils are a lie contrived by scientists Satan and one day soon Jesus Christ will be the first person to ever reincarnate (as Himself even) so He can take all of His believers to Heaven before the end of the world... like those Heaven's Gate wackos did). This is my bidding so let it be done. Oh yeah, and I also summon your females to sleep with me so that I may impregnate them with my magical "God of Atheism" sperm.

I encourage you Ed to continually update your pages, but I assure you one day soon you will see that I am indeed the One True Leader of the human race and the resistance you show only exposes the fact that you know I am right.

Bob

The resistance I show exposes my concern. The resistance you show exposes that you have not yet found what you are looking for. This search alone, is a proof that we were meant for more. My dog isn't looking for anything ... but you are, Bob. Isn't that interesting ...

Bob, I did not mean to frustrate you so much. Really, I apologize about comparing you to a cult leader. I take it back.

I am only trying to show that your atheist-prone evidences seem to come from someone who simply does not want to believe in God and not from someone who has all sorts of mind-boggling proof. I am offering stuff that points to God. You continually mock and refute this evidence, and that's fine. It's often quite funny really. But you give no evidence of your own. Sure you point to self centered, overly-righteous people claiming to be Jesus Freaks, you point to the "religion" of Christianity with all its hypocrisy and suburban churchy, club-like attitudes with cheesy smiles and poor taste for clothing, but this only proves that people are much less than good, honest or trustworthy. This has nothing to do with God.v

I would be annoyed if a person claiming to be a friend of mine did something stupid and caused the world to think that I must be stupid by association. The idiotic action of a shortsighted acquaintance does not change the fact that I'm a great guy, Bob.

All that to say ... God can exist in spite of those who follow him.

So ... show me the money ...

Eddie
P.S. Speaking of money, I put a link to 35 "big ones" on my evidences page that point to intelligent design.
P.P.S. I will be in Chicago sometime in August ... we should do lunch.

Edward Britz.
ejdiaz@chartermi.net

Oh holy God I NEVER want to meet you! Now I understand why you've kept this email correspondence going with me for as long as you have! You've got a crush on me! Ak! I've moved from Chicago and there's no way I'm going to volunteer the location of where I am now.... No fuckin' way.

You're loony Ed! I'm realizing now that you quite possibly have fallen in love with me too! YOU CAN NOT BE PART OF MY CULT!

It's neat though how our different "resistances" are. Now this next part is for my blessed minions:

Minions! As your God Of Atheism I present to you Edward Britz, our living sacrifice to Christianity so that we may all bear witness to how easily the human mind can rationalize the absurd.

Watch as an adult male ignores the proof human logic presents in our every day lives. See how stupid someone can be made out to look as they try to defend stupidity. Then learn from the idiotic actions of this shortsighted acquaintance who actually thinks of himself as a "great guy".

Understand the mindset of someone who sells their soul to religion and submits to the madness therein. Taste his blindness for the bitter poison that it is and refuse even a spoonful of fantasy! It will waste your lives! Your effort will be LESS because the fantasy is the reason you live!

You will be doomed to draw pictures of woodland creatures on corncobs for the rest of your days because your Christianity doesn't permit you to illustrate your true passions! And finally, you will fall in love with other men simply because they are free to say and do as they please without the restrictions written on a 2000 year old rule book by cavemen with unibrows and poor grooming habits.

Now say goodbye to Ed because we have all had our fill.
Bye bye Ed....
Forever.